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Сообщение от gog

Нюрнбергский процесс тоже опровергать будете? Вы что сюда подосланы наши мозги промывать? Неужели не видите,что своей бендеровщиной только раздражение рождаете. В России фашизм проклят на века и все что с фашизмом связано тоже. Только вот пусть Владимир Цапков не вспомнит про российских скинхедов-идеи которых питаются с таких как вы.

А какое отношение имеет Нюрнбергский процесс к УПА? Там ни про ОУН, ни про УПА вопрос вообще не стоял. Не хотите говорить по документам - не надо. Но чтобы не быть голословным: http://www.yale.edu/lawweb/avalon/imt/imt.htm тут РЕАЛЬНЫЕ документы Нюрнберга. При чем их там намного больше, чем когда-нибудь было опубликовано в СССР. Найдите хоть что-то в осуждение ОУН-УПА. Там даже по "Нахтигалю", "Роланду" не было вообще ничего В ПРИНЦИПЕ, можете сами проверить. Я искал по ключевым словам "Бандера" и УПА. Про УПА сами поищите, про Бандеру вот что выдало, надеюсь, английский понимаете:

(See also the morale report which will be ready in a short time "Legacy of the Soviets in the Ukrainian Areas"concluded at the end of September 1941)

Enclosure 8. http://www.yale.edu/lawweb/avalon/imt/docu...ol4/1526-ps.htm

As a reprisal for the shooting of a member of the German police in Lwow who was killed by an unknown perpetrator in the second half of November 1942, 28 Ukrainians were shot in Lwow, and 56 in Czortkow who were at the time in prison in these towns. Nobody was told the reason for the shooting, and the shootings in Czortkow were carried out in broad day-light before the eyes of the frightened population. Among the persons shot were many suffering from typhoid who were taken from the hospital whilst unconscious, loaded on to trucks, and taken to the place of execution.

These shootings were to be considered as reprisals against the so-called "Bandera" group. Among the persons shot were elderly citizens who had no connection whatever with the activities of this group, as for instance Dr. Olexa Kossak, lawyer from Kolomea, engineer Andrij Pjaseckyj, head-gamekeeper in Janiw near Lwow all of whom had been vouched for not only by myself and Dr. Kost Pankiskyj, but by Reich Germans as well.

http://www.yale.edu/lawweb/avalon/im...ent/054-ps.htm
Document 054-PS

The Reichminister
For The Occupied Eastern Territories C.P., 7 October 1942
The Representative at the Army Sector B. L 14/10
To the Reich Ministry for the Occupied Eastern Territories, Chief Section I,
BERLIN, Unter den Linden 63.

Reprint to Captain Lorenz Hg. of the High Command of the Army

Subject: Treatment of Ukrainian Specialists.

Enclosures:-2-

Attached I send you the copy of a report made by the Commandant of the Collecting Center for Specialists at Charkow. (report submitted at the end of September 1942) as well as the copy of a letter from April 1942.

Relative to the treatment of Ukrainian specialists in the Reich, I was asked by the Chief of Staff of the Commander in Chief to attend to the matter most emphatically since the complaints here never cease. I have discussed it thoroughly with the chief of section VII at the Commander in Chief's. I went to see Captain Schmid and visited the camp. As synopsis of the discussions with the gentlemen and reading of reports the following can be established in general:

a. With some few exceptions the Ukrainians employed individually in the Reich e.g. at small trade plants, as agricultural laborers, as domestic helps, etc., are very satisfied with their conditions.

b. The Ukrainians sheltered in the community camps, however, complain very much.

The enclosed report of Captain Schmid reports these matters in detail.

The question of treatment of the Ukrainians, transported to the Reich as workers of the East worries the bureaus of the Army concerned a great deal. The Commander in Chief urged me to visit some of the camps in the Reich myself as soon as possible and to report to the proper authorities in order to bring about immediate relief. The Army zone is by no means satisfied. All the circumstances of discontent contribute more and more to more people joining the bands or wandering away to the camp of the Bandera esp. other groups hostile to us.

The best propaganda of all would be to treat the workers of the East well; great demands are not made by the Ukrainians anyhow. If their treatment will only be somewhat better and humanely decent these people, who make in part a good impression, will be more than satisfied; these people after all came to the Greater German Reich at least at the beginning of the employment of workers of the East in the Reich of their own free will and full of hope. The unsuitable treatment described in the reports is hardly propaganda and is not profitable for us. After all, we are not at war with the Ukrainian population and certainly not with people who by their voluntary enlistment for labor, help us to win the war.

It also would serve our purposes definitely better to utilize the specialist in his specialty.

[signed] THEURER (Theurer)

1st Lieutenant Copy of Copy

Collecting Center for Skilled Workers at Charkow. Captain Schmid, Commandant.

To the Commander of the Army Sector B., Section VII CHARKOW

Subject. Abuses in the treatment of Ukrainian skilled workers. By reason of my capacity as commandant of the Collecting Center for skilled workers and the transport of skilled workers to the Reich connected with it and thereby being in touch with the various groups of the Ukrainian population, I am informed of the morale of the Ukrainians in the extended surroundings of the Eastern Ukraine. Resulting from this knowledge I have to state that an atmosphere of animosity has taken the place of the original attitude toward the Reich. This sudden change of mood is connected partly with the scarcity of food for the civilian population caused by the war and intensified by the measures for centralization. The more important motive the extreme abuses which have taken place at various times in the treatment of skilled workers shipped to Germany.

Since a prosperous economic cooperation with the 35 million people of the Ukraine lies within the interest of our coming generations and since the Ukrainians themselves are organically healthy, very capable of development and rich in valuable and willing constructive forces, it is necessary to prevent in time an estrangement starting at the roots and to recognize the beginnings of the disastrous development before it is too late, and to take effective countermeasures.

http://www.yale.edu/lawweb/avalon/im...ent/053-ps.htm
REPORT 10
(Concluded on 5 October 1941)
SECRET

(See also the morale report which will be ready in a short time "Legacy of the Soviets in the Ukrainian Areas"concluded at the end of September 1941)

Up till now, the Bandera people could not fulfill their original plan, the establishment of a self-supporting government in Kiev, since the "Command Kiew" which was to perform this, was removed by the security service [SD] in Fastow and Wassilkow; in the first days after the occupation of the city, they pasted small propaganda placards right next to the German governmental publications, however without much result. Also handbills, in which it was tried to justify the attentat of Shitomir, remain ineffective. The burning of Kiev and the strict screening of the population following thereafter [Sichtungen] have caused, it seems, a (passing) standstill in the organizational construction of the Bandera group.

From the Melnyk organization it was possible to obtain a secret directive called "in Matters of Propaganda"; aside from the old and well-known requests (self-rule demands of totalitarianism, national socialistic philosophy of life) the following is noticeable in regards to the Reich's relative points (Par. 1: "The special aim is to obtain a clarification of the relations to the German factors. It is to be pointed out that Germany is at war with Moscow and therefore is our ally which one must support in battle. At the same time it is emphasized that the opportunity of the construction of a Ukrainian political system does not only depend alone on the Germans but also on our own combined organization and on our ability to produce. Our motto here is: "Our strength lies in ourselves." (This settlement of a German policy differentiates itself despite their careful composure and stipulation, fundamentally from the rules laid down by Banderas, in which to my knowledge it was, up until now, referred to as "allies", often set in quotation marks but never used in connection with the specific references to the Reich.)....

There are Ukrainian newspapers in Kamienec Podolsk, Rowne, Berditschew; Winnica, Shitomir, Uman, Kirowograd, Nowo-Ukrainka, Kriwoirog, Cherson, Nikolajew and Kiev (perhaps in a few other places); the papers are published from once to six times weekly and are mostly, fairly pure newspapers; some (naturally censored) articles deal with the anti-bolshevistics and in the field of German-Ukrainian cooperation (thankfulness for the emancipation similar parallels, etc.). The following ground rules pertain to the technique of foreign propaganda: The term Ukraine can only be used in a territorial ( not pertaining to state) sense; the Reich is not an "ally", but a "protector" of the Ukraine; the German Wehrmacht is not "garrisoned" (or even "occupationally army" as was formulated by several Bandera men) but instead "saviors"; the title "Fuehrer-Emancipator" is to be used when talking of Adolf Hitler, etc.; as far as these directives went, they were looked upon as natural and obeyed without a trace of objection.

Кто не понимает - там про нелояльность бандеровцев и расстрелы украинцев в знак возмездия против деятельности Бандеры. Впрочем если документы неинтересны - больше не буду, вроде уже все сказал, каждый все-равно останется при своем.